Blimey, That Far !

Sky Kite

New member
I'm still a newbie to all this and am a curious soul so, at the club shoot yesterday, in light rain and no wind, I shot my first 'flight arrow'.

Well, without especially trying at all and using the bog standard club training bow, I was pretty surprised about how far it went.

After going into the next field and searching around a bit, I eventually found my arrow. It was lodged in the (soft muddy) ground at about a 30 degree angle, sunk up to about 1/3 of the way along the shaft.

I paced the flight distance as being 213 metres (233 yards). (Having also measured that 35 of my paces was the equivalent of 30 metres). This was across fairly level ground but it was also quite muddy, so I'm guessing that the arrow actually went somewhere between around 200 and 220 metres (220 to 240 yards).

This was with a Club Training Recurve Bow, which pulls 28lbs at 28 inches & I guess I overdrew it by about an inch (my normal draw is around 27 inches and I took it to near my ear). The arrow weighs 22.5 grammes (8 of them weigh about 180 grammes on the kitchen scales).

My understanding from other threads etc is that, in Medieval times, a standard test for an archer joining the English army was for them to shoot at least 220 yards, i.e. the same distance I shot yesterday.

Given that they were trained since kids and pulling draw weights of anything up to 100 lbs and more (though they were also shooting arrows that weighed anything up to 1/4 lb), I'm thinking that this clearly demonstrates the improvements gained by modern technology !

Is this sort of distance typical for a bog standard modern recurve training bow of this kind of weight ?
 

2leftfeet

New member
Ha ha glad it's not just me :).....I did exactly the same thing this weekend. I was at the bottom of a sloping field, gave myself what I thought was plenty of room, aimed about 45 degrees in the air and let fly. Well it just went sailing over the brow of the hill and I spent the next half hour looking for it in the woods beyond. Found the arrow eventually!! Great feeling though isn't it watching your arrow go sailing through the air.
 

Sky Kite

New member
It was great - made me feel like a kid again !

No worries about scoring - just letting fly and seeing how far it would go - brilliant !
 

Furface

Moderator
Supporter
Ooo er missus. Don't want to pee on your enthusiasm, but, if anything had happened, you couldn't have relied on GNAS club insurance, either of you.
 

Sky Kite

New member
Yeah, thanks Furface - I nearly put a 'DON'T TRY THIS AT HOME' notice on the thread.

But - (a) It was fun, and (b) I double checked that nothing was down range for a very long way.

To continue being serious for a moment, I'm actually pretty gobsmacked that my beginner's course didn't include doing this. This was a perfect demonstration of how powerful even a training bow is these days and, personally, I think it is very important to know how far your arrows will go if you get it 'horribly wrong' for example and how dangerous this bent stick thing is if you mess about with it.

In addition, I noted that some more experienced members of the club were also a bit surprised about how far my arrow went - and I'm guessing that they just haven't ever tried it ......
 

2leftfeet

New member
Ooo er missus. Don't want to pee on your enthusiasm, but, if anything had happened, you couldn't have relied on GNAS club insurance, either of you.
Fair point Furface, thanks, but without boring you with the details there was zero risk otherwise I would never have shot the arrow.
 

MSR

Member
AIUK Saviour
At my club we hold regular clout shoots every year: one seasonal competition with a trophy and one to commemorate Agincourt! So we are all very familiar with the distance even a modest bow can achieve. We are also blessed with a bloody big field. My 28# wooden beginners bow (36# on the fingers) would easily get to the far side and nearly did when I tried a shooting technique that I've seen in that 'For the love of the English bow' youtube video (bending the right leg and leaning right back before loosing). My god, I missed the target by miles! Which is probably why we do clout and not flight - people live over there on the other side of the trees! There's houses and pets and even small children and stuff. Beginners, whether they've just graduated from the club's course or not, generally don't take part but do witness proceedings and therefore, develop a better understanding of the capabilities of this lethal weapon. How could they not? By the time we've walked over to the target and are looking back, the beginner's on their shooting line (plinking away at about 20 or 30 yards) are just a couple of inches tall.

Yes, indeed. We are familiar with the ballistic properties of pointy sticks in this part of the world!
 

Sky Kite

New member
Hi MSR - I think that's a REALLY good thing you guys do.

Obviously, not all clubs will have the space to do that but I really do think that its important for everyone who shoots a bow to know what its capable of.

As I said above, there were some fairly experienced target archers around on Sunday who were a bit surprised by my arrow.

Apart from anything else, its absolutely fascinating and I can't actually believe that anyone who owns a bow doesn't really want to know how far it will shoot ! :)
 

Toxophilomanian

New member
Hi,
Even modest recurve bows can shoot in excess of 300 yards these days. I have regularly shot over 440 yards (1/4 mile) with my 50 pounder, but compared to the world record of over 500 yards for a 50 pounder and 600 yards for a bow of about 80 lbs, this is a poor distance. I hope, given some new equipment, I will better 600 yards with a 50 lb recurve in summer. If you want to see the real McCoy flight shooting, we have two flight shoots at Church Fenton nr Leeds in August.
 

Darryl

New member
Interesting, I was reading about Zak Crawford who won the seniors under-35lb world record today. Not bad considering he's only 14! I believe this record was smashed at Church Fenton.

As for posing no risk to innocent bystanders? One of you I believe mentioned that it went over the brow of a hill and into wooded areas. So how do you know there wasn't human, pet or livestock in this area? Secondly, how could you gauge what was considered a "safe zone" when neither of you having fired flight before had any idea of what distance was achievable with the given bow poundage and arrow type????
 

Toxophilomanian

New member
Hi Daryl,

Given your comments, this is why I feel it important to know exactly how far our modern bows can shoot, not by trying it at your club but for each region to host a flight shoot. It is only when you look back from where your arrow lands towards the shooting line that you really appreciate the power in your bow. Two years ago, our judge at the NCAS flight shoot looked on Google Earth and compared how far the winning arrow went with the area where he lives - 12 streets he said!!!! Remember the GNAS rules about the distance of overshoots behind the target. And why do you think the high-draw is banned (except for flight and clout shoots).

As an archer talking to non-archers, never mind how many times do you hit the "bull", I just wish I had a pond for every time I have been asked the question "how far will it shoot?.
 

Sky Kite

New member
As for posing no risk to innocent bystanders? One of you I believe mentioned that it went over the brow of a hill and into wooded areas. So how do you know there wasn't human, pet or livestock in this area? Secondly, how could you gauge what was considered a "safe zone" when neither of you having fired flight before had any idea of what distance was achievable with the given bow poundage and arrow type????
Hi Darryl, I can't speak for others (and it wasn't me with the hill) but please give me some credit for not being completely stupid. The field in which my arrow landed was flat, had been recently ploughed and was massive. I guess I could see for about 1.5 kilometres to the hedge on the far side of it. I was shooting a 28 lb training bow and I'm aware of the sort of general distances achieved by other archers etc. I was guessing that my arrow was going to go somewhere between 150 and 200 yards - in fact, it went quite a bit further than this, which was very interesting to me, but I knew it wasn't going to go a kilometre.

Generally speaking, I find that in life, if you don't insult people's intelligence, they don't tend to insult yours in return .....

I also find that curiosity is generally a good thing - and I get quite annoyed with inappropriate 'health and safety' comments, as this completely de-values the concept.


Edited to add:- Sorry Darryl, just re-read this and its a bit 'in your face', which I didn't intend it to be - but, despite appearances, I really am not totally stupid !
 

Sky Kite

New member
If you want to see the real McCoy flight shooting, we have two flight shoots at Church Fenton nr Leeds in August.
Thanks toxo, I'll look out for those (I know Church Fenton as a Meteorological Station, rather than an archery range !) although its quite a way away from me down here in Hampshire.

I understand the problems in this crowded country but its a shame that there aren't very many other places in England where flight shooting takes place .....

(Perhaps it could be done from the beach out over the sea, using a radar to measure distance - tho we'd lose all the arrows unless we had some sort of recovery beacon/device and made sure they float).
 

payneib

Supporter
Supporter
If you want to see the real McCoy flight shooting, we have two flight shoots at Church Fenton nr Leeds in August.
Hi Tox,

What date is that on? I've just done a quick google, and the northern counties champs came up on the 7th. Is that the one? If so, are us southerners welcome? I've just had an idea........................
 

SVL

The American
Fonz Awardee
Ironman
American Shoot
Nice to see more people interested in Flight shooting.
I attended the NCAS and the National Flight champs at Church Fenton last years for the first time. There were plenty of Southerners at the flight champs. If you can do try to enter. There is also another competition further south.... but right now I cannot remember where. I will look it up and get back to you on this. Have a quick look at the GNAS rule book and you can determine which classification you might be in. You can enter more than one classification. Some of the experts put alot of time into custom made arrows for flight. I am hoping to be able to attend a flight shoot again this year, even if I do have to travel from Belgium.

But as Furface and others have said don't just shoot flight and hope it all goes ok, I saw a compound archer shoot over 1km. Any field for shooting flight must be flat and longer than the current record for the bow classification. So you might be fortunite to have afield long enough for only some bow classifications. If your really interested you should measure your field and get a region judge to OK it for flight before shooting. If you can cover all bow classifications, seriously consider hosting a flight shoot.
 

SVL

The American
Fonz Awardee
Ironman
American Shoot
The other flight shoot in the UK is organsied by WMAS and held in Shropshire. I have also heard from Mike Willrich that SCAS are considering holding a flight shoot.
 
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