Thumb and little finger of the drawing hand.

BadFrog

Member
Has anyone been taught that the thumb and little finger of the drawing hand MUST touch each other at all time during the draw?

My son is an experienced archer who has gone off to university. The club there insists that, regardless of previous experience or GNAS certificates, everyone must take and pass a beginners course. Part of the teaching on the course is that the thumb and little finger of the drawing hand must touch the whole time.

Is this something new as it seems to me to give a very unnatural (and uncomfortable) hand position.
 

Timid Toad

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It is a great hand position if it can be achieved. Very consistent, it makes sure the hand is at the right angle and helps relax the wrist and forearm.
 

geoffretired

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Supporter
Hi BadFrog,I have heard of that before but not come across the word MUST when relating it to shooting.
I can see that having the thumb and little finger in different positions from shot to shot could add a variable,but relaxing both should get rid of variables without making an effort to keep them together.
 

hooktonboy

The American
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American Shoot
Hi BadFrog,I have heard of that before but not come across the word MUST when relating it to shooting.
It does seem to be pretty popular under some current methods including Archery GB (check the coaching videos especially the set-up one at about 2:20) and NTS. I don't think"must" really comes into it, though...

Do hope the uni don't propose to fail people from the beginners course if they can't..... Sounds like someone went on a level 1 course, and heard "recommended" as "must".....
 

dvd8n

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Supporter
AIUK Saviour
In my beginners course a few years ago I was taught to hold my little finger down with my thumb while drawing by pressing on the knuckle.

It never occurred to me that there was another way to do it.
 

Trunkles

The American
American Shoot
I tell people to hold the little finger with the thumb to get them out of the (blooming) way but not MUST. Otherwise they tend to poke their eye or touch the nock end with the thumb.
 

Bertybobby

New member
I've just tried and can't physically do it!

I just allow my little pinky to naturally curl with the other fingers and tuck my thumb in.
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Watched the video and it is shown as something she does; I didn't hear any comment about it so it wasn't discussed as something to be done.(or did I miss that?)
 

hooktonboy

The American
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American Shoot
Watched the video and it is shown as something she does; I didn't hear any comment about it so it wasn't discussed as something to be done.(or did I miss that?)
Do you know, I would have gone on oath and said it was mentioned in the vid, but it isn't... you didn't miss it, I imagined hearing it...

It's very deliberately done in the vid, isn't it?
 

Simon Banks

Active member
I never heard of it until somebody suggest do it to make my my anchor point more consistent,, It used to be middle finger to corner of mouth now it's thumb and little finger to back of my jawbone...
 

hooktonboy

The American
Ironman
American Shoot
I think the FITA position is that "no tension should enter the thumb or little finger and they should remain relaxed at all times". So I suppose it's a question of whether you can touch them together and stay relaxed. I certainly can't - my hand is broad compared to the length of fingers, if I try to do that I can't keep the back of my hand flat and relaxed.
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Do you know, I would have gone on oath and said it was mentioned in the vid, but it isn't... you didn't miss it, I imagined hearing it...

It's very deliberately done in the vid, isn't it?
Yes, she deliberately crosses them together. Not sure where she was asked/told to do that. I have to wonder why it wasn't given a mention in the video. Perhaps it is a personal thing she does.
 

its my party and

Active member
Ironman
I have looked at it objectively had a go and I feel it adds tension to the wrist trying to hold the thumb down! When I teach I teach that the thumb should be always pointing in a relaxed manner towards the string but not touching it! This way it keeps the wrist and hand relaxed provides a good reference point with the thumb pointing upwards when on a tab with a shelf and also keeps with the straight line theory! A simple test I did which you should do is,
Hook your fingers (as if holding a string) then relax your hand upright on a table across your body in front of you hand upright. Where does your thumb sit? Now put the two, the little finger and thumb together. Whats the difference you feel tension wise in the back of your hand? I have never heard of the practice of joining said digits but I don't think its the best method to teach.
Interestingly on the other issue I have been told by a junior AGB shooter who has just gone to Uni that it was insisted that she also take a beginners course!
I have to say as suggested it sounds like some coach has build a little castle in their domain and you must do as they say! A little bit of common sense should prevail, alas some university students don't have that much so that might be why this is happening at Universities was it mentioned in which area this was?
 

Timid Toad

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I've learned to shoot this way some years after my beginners! It works and I like it.

Back to the OP, my advice to your son would be give it a go through the remainder of the course at Uni. If he starts to get on with it and enjoy it, all well and good. If not, and as he is an experienced archer, wait till the course finishes and go back to doing the way he used to.
 

tel

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to be seasonal, what a load of conkers! Whoever is coaching this as a must ought not to be coaching.
 

Timid Toad

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Don't knock it till you've tried it!
I agree the "must" bit is a bit much, but it is a good technique if you can manage it.
 

fbirder

Member
I'm just finishing my first year since my beginners course and I must say that I've probably been hindered by various things I've been advised that I 'must' do almost as much as I've been helped. I've learned that, when told what I 'must' do, the best option is to give it a try and see if it works - for me.
 

roytherecurve

New member
to be seasonal, what a load of conkers! Whoever is coaching this as a must ought not to be coaching.
I must concur here!
If the archer cannot physically do this then the coach should not be saying "Must", Which is never what is being said, I have seen the clip and its not even mentioned and the archer demonstrating does not hold the finger with her thumb so where is this coming from?
You should not be doing anything that sets up any tension within the string grip other than that required to hold the string otherwise the release will not be as smooth and effortless as it should be. It certainly won't be if you are concentrating on keeping the finger held by the thumb!

I can see what is trying to be achieved here but there are other ways to achieve the same thing without having to hold the finger with the thumb.

I have tried it myself and cannot physically do it either, but have never considered it to be necessary in order to get a good string grip without interference.
This wasn't taught on my level one course so I can't see why this club's coaches see it as a requirement in order to shoot correctly. I think they need to re-evaluate their coaches methods as there will be many archers put off by a coach insisting that they do something that is not possible for many, including myself! and I have shot for my county so I can't be that bad!
 

Mufti

Member
"The club there insists that, regardless of previous experience or GNAS certificates, everyone must take and pass a beginners course."

An assessment - certainly, but a full course?

What purpose does a GNAS certificate serve if not proof that you have already taken and passed a beginner's course?

What checks are in place to prevent such situations?
What process is in place to correct them?
 

texvaughan

New member
I've only been shooting since July of 2012 but I certainly haven't seen nor heard of this before. In fact I've been watching the championships on Archery.tv for the last three weeks and I don't recall seeing any of the championship archers doing this...seems like someone's preference to me or (like someone earlier said) one of the coaches has heard "preferably" as "must".
 
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