Using the release aid- part 2

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Having taken note of all that was written in my other thread about learning to use a release aid, I decided to try the method where there is no conscious effort to press the trigger.
I did have some success, but I've been there before!!!
Not every shot went off according to plan but some unexpected shots did highlight something that seems,to me, to be important.
Every now and again, the shot went off with no apparent input from me. I did not see this as a good thing because it sometimes went off before I was really on aim. I felt much better about the shots that went off without my thinking about the trigger, but after I had started to pull harder against the stops.It was as if the extra pull was activating the release. I did not need to take my concentration from the gold, just aim and keep the draw from going the wrong way.
Does that sound right?
 

Martin Heelis

Active member
Ironman
I'm working on that exact method at the moment. I've only done it for a couple of sessions so far but it seems very promising. The bad shots are not as bad as before which is nice.
 

dunhoo

New member
I feel sure this is the way forward to the next level i.e. 1300+ at a FITA, the bad shots seem to get a better result and for me it is not a case of shooting more 10`s it is avoiding 5,6, and 7?s that will improve my score so that low 50?s ends at 70m turn into middle 50?s.
I think that the active shot cycle is the answer to tournament pressure, but it is not something that comes overnight as you need to train your muscles to the new active movements by shooting alot of arrows and accepting that you may not get the results in the beginning. This is why I have always sneeked back to a trigger squeeze with mild tension that works well for may but for me does not work under pressure as I freeze and can?t get the shot do go.

I can see that there are alot of passive compound archers who shoot well on the WC circuit e.g. Trillius and Pagni but I think they must be mentally very strong to use this technic under pressure especially during the hit and miss tournaments (pagni certainly seem to have struggled this year looking at the rankings).

I am certainly going to change my signature to Push, Pull and Believe and will keep you informed of progress.
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Cheers, Both.
I feel that ,NOT pulling into the stops at the end is a "soft" way of shooting, as if I don't want to do anything except stand and aim.It seems better, to be working and the follow through blends in with that pull. The release is in there somewhere and has to happen. Shooting without that pull seems as if the release may or may not happen;not so reassuring.
 

Ozzy

Member
I feel sure this is the way forward to the next level i.e. 1300+ at a FITA, the bad shots seem to get a better result and for me it is not a case of shooting more 10`s it is avoiding 5,6, and 7?s that will improve my score so that low 50?s ends at 70m turn into middle 50?s.
I think that the active shot cycle is the answer to tournament pressure, but it is not something that comes overnight as you need to train your muscles to the new active movements by shooting alot of arrows and accepting that you may not get the results in the beginning. This is why I have always sneeked back to a trigger squeeze with mild tension that works well for may but for me does not work under pressure as I freeze and can?t get the shot do go.

I can see that there are alot of passive compound archers who shoot well on the WC circuit e.g. Trillius and Pagni but I think they must be mentally very strong to use this technic under pressure especially during the hit and miss tournaments (pagni certainly seem to have struggled this year looking at the rankings).

I am certainly going to change my signature to Push, Pull and Believe and will keep you informed of progress.
Trillus uses an index finger trigger & would have to be one of the few top compounders that punch the release aid, so he is one of the fortunate that the tecnique hasn't lead to disaster.
Pagni uses a Cascade release aid, which is the "reverse trip" thumb trigger, which can lead to punching big time if not mastered. He sure does OK with it, eh ?
We are seeing more top level compounders appearing with hinge releases now. The U.S. men are an example & they are always right up there & their top level using thumb triggers are using them correctly.
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Hi Ozzy,
I shot at 60y tonight, as opposed to in the garage at 4y. I found that drawing harder into the stops, with a bit of elbow movement into line, brought a surprise release. I also felt that I was part of that release, rather than a by stander.I was making it happen, not by triggering, but by aiming and keeping the tension on the string.
If had had been drinking before hand, I could have believed I was using a hinge release, it was so similar in the way the shot progressed.
The biggest difference was that I had no anxiety about the release going too soon. Also, my way of trying to prevent an early release with a hinge means I
use the index finger to take most of the weight of the draw and that hurts. It also means that the hand has to wait around to settle and relax properly.
It would seem that a hinge with safety would get rid of that problem and the shots that misfire.
 

Howi

Member
with all hinge and weight operated releases, the key to a CONSISTENT release is CONSISTENT hand position.
The slightest change in hand position/orientation means the geometry of the release changes hence early or late (mostly) operation to the norm.
The only way to get that consistency is shooting lots of arrows.
Lets face it, if it were that easy, release manufacturers would go out of business and we would all shoot perfect scores - now! wouldn't that be boring.......:bomb:
 
G

GuardianAngel

Guest
...with a bit of elbow movement into line, brought a surprise release.
I remember saying this is one of your previous posts. Release aid usage is not an isolated function. The biggest crucial thing for me with good form and release aid usage is alignment. Making sure that the rear elbow is in line will mean the shot will break effortlessly, and it will really steady your aim.
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Thanks Howi and GA,
I appreciate that hand consistency is important, I have found in the time I used mine that slight changes made a difference.I was unable to detect the changes until it showed up in the delay or early release.I felt out of control, to the point where I went back to the trigger type. Some went during the draw and caused misfires.The apprehension that causes, makes me feel the safety trigger is a big benefit.
GA, in my shooting last night I found alignment( bow arm and draw arm) was playing a large part in the way the shot was triggered and the way it felt, too. I was shooting some good groups with an odd stray. I usually shoot evenly spaced, fairly poor groups.
 

PetrolHead

Member
AIUK Saviour
Thanks Howi and GA,
I appreciate that hand consistency is important, I have found in the time I used mine that slight changes made a difference.I was unable to detect the changes until it showed up in the delay or early release.I felt out of control, to the point where I went back to the trigger type. Some went during the draw and caused misfires.The apprehension that causes, makes me feel the safety trigger is a big benefit.
GA, in my shooting last night I found alignment( bow arm and draw arm) was playing a large part in the way the shot was triggered and the way it felt, too. I was shooting some good groups with an odd stray. I usually shoot evenly spaced, fairly poor groups.
Do you have your thumb on the trigger as you draw?
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Hi PetrolHead,
With the hinge, I press the thumb against the end of the release which acts as if turning the handle towards the safe side.
With a thumb trigger I have my thumb off the trigger until I reach the full draw and then curl round.
 

PetrolHead

Member
AIUK Saviour
Hi PetrolHead,
With the hinge, I press the thumb against the end of the release which acts as if turning the handle towards the safe side.
With a thumb trigger I have my thumb off the trigger until I reach the full draw and then curl round.
Thats fine then :)
We have a few people that have started shooting compound and I was actually asked "I keep releasing before I get to full draw and I don't know why, can you help?" ...They had their thumb on the trigger...:mind-blow
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Heehee, I suppose the thumb does relax naturally beside the trigger. Easily done when starting out and so much to remember.
 

Howi

Member
Thanks Howi and GA,
I appreciate that hand consistency is important, I have found in the time I used mine that slight changes made a difference.I was unable to detect the changes until it showed up in the delay or early release.I felt out of control, to the point where I went back to the trigger type. Some went during the draw and caused misfires.The apprehension that causes, makes me feel the safety trigger is a big benefit.
GA, in my shooting last night I found alignment( bow arm and draw arm) was playing a large part in the way the shot was triggered and the way it felt, too. I was shooting some good groups with an odd stray. I usually shoot evenly spaced, fairly poor groups.
Getting rid of any apprehension should go a long way to helping you, having the safety trigger would most certainly help - just don't forget, even with a safety the release can still fire, if the settings are too light ( probably not on all releases with safety, but certainly some I have used! trying to stop a large flow of blood with no tissues and still having to shoot, is no fun + it hurts.
Personally, I wouldn't use a release without safety feature, just for the peace of mind ( something less to worry about)

Have you settled on any particular release yet?
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Hi Howi, Thanks again for your input. I find that drawing the release safely involves pulling in such an odd way that it is uncomfortable on the index finger. Then I have to try to relax into a natural position; followed by the final stage to activate the release. I am quite happy to draw, anchor then press a safety, then work for the last stage. I was used to that with the Loesch.
I was loaned a Tru Ball Sweet Spot 11. It was great in all respects, but one. The safety trigger was pressing into my neck, causing a kind of "swallowing" reflex.
I have been looking into getting Carter 2.75 when the money allows.
 

Ozzy

Member
Hi Howi, Thanks again for your input. I find that drawing the release safely involves pulling in such an odd way that it is uncomfortable on the index finger. Then I have to try to relax into a natural position; followed by the final stage to activate the release. I am quite happy to draw, anchor then press a safety, then work for the last stage. I was used to that with the Loesch.
I was loaned a Tru Ball Sweet Spot 11. It was great in all respects, but one. The safety trigger was pressing into my neck, causing a kind of "swallowing" reflex.
I have been looking into getting Carter 2.75 when the money allows.
Gee Geoff, it sounds like you are making a real chore out of a BT release aid ?
If the release aid is set coarse, they shouldn't be "uncomfortable" to draw without a misfire.
If the most of weight is on the index finger in the draw,anchor, make a fist, aim, relax/lift the index finger, apply back tension, & the hinge will rotate & bingo - X ! :poulies:
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Hi Ozzy,
I think you are right; I am making things more complicated than they are.
So, are you saying that, the grip on the handle from the start of the draw to reaching the anchor point should be a fairly tight fist? Then relax the index finger and pull.
A coarse setting will keep everything safe,yes?
A coarse setting means the handle has to move quite a bit during the aiming stage.( that's what I noticed, anyway) Is that normal?
 

Ozzy

Member
That's about it, Geoff.
It really should be almost a continuos pulling motion, with finger pressure altering for activation.
I hated the Carter 2.75. Lump of a thing.
Keep it simple.
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Hi Ozzy,
I know what you mean about a lump of a thing. Simple hinge types are very neat.
I think the Loesch takes the lump prize!
 
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