ACE 570s or ace 520s

bolerus

Member
ok, so I have been trying to make this decision for a few weeks, and I am no closer, so I need some advice please

I shoot recurve.

currently I am using a set of second hand ACE 570. at 28.5 with pin nocks and light points ( 86grains)

bareshaft tuning they are a little stiff ( since i put the pin nocks in) but only a little, and well its better to shoot too stiff than too whippy


looking at the easton charts I could either have 570s at 28 inch or 520s at 29 inch. I use a magnetic click, so I could easily go as far as 31 inches if i really wanted to.

My draw length is a tad under 29 inch now ( 27.25 from nock to button)

so what I can decide is whether to go for 570s at 28 ( well 28.5) with slightly heavier points than I have in these old ones. OR 520s at 29 inch.

the 570s are lighter so slightly better sight marks , but ( at least with these points in ) I am certainly losing points at 80 yards. Our field has virtually no wind protection and the wind seems to change direction a lot.


or the 520s, with I will lose sight marks but should be slightly better in the wind ( being heavier)

At 80 yards, I am not great, and seem to average about 36 an end ( imperial) with occasional bad end about 30 and occasional good end of 42 or 46. (on saturday I shot an end, first 4 arrows were all gold, then wind kicked up and last 2 arrows both went in black)


I believe that I am a little better than those scores ( I know it is hard to compare but my indoor portsmouth best is 569 ) - (last season with ACGs I was getting a little higher but I couldnt reach 100yards with the ACG which is something I want to factor in)


I do need some more arrows / shafts , as I have only got 9 ACE, ( bough second hand) and one of them ALWAYS goes high and left, so I think it has a bit of a problem.

I have been looking on ebay to see if anyone is selling 3 or 4 570s so i can have a play and compare, but no joy so far.

what do you guys think, what would be the best option?
 

Rik

Supporter
Supporter
The point weight doesn't make a great deal of difference. The length on the other hand does.

Personally, if that was my choice, I would go for 28.25" (the charts are set for a one inch overhang past the rest) 570s. If they turn up slightly stiff, turn the weight up slightly. The slight increase in length might do it though. Spine is much more sensitive to the length than the point weight.
But personally, I'd also stick (at least) 100 grain monobloc points in them.

<Edit> You're holding 45 pounds or more...?
 

bolerus

Member
have i read it wrong..

i have 42 pound on the fingers

- - - Updated - - -

have i read it wrong..

i have 42 pound on the fingers
 

mbaker74

Supporter
Supporter
AIUK Saviour
When you say your current ACE's are too stiff, how far to the left of the fletched group are the bare shafts at 30 metres?

- - - Updated - - -

When you say your current ACE's are too stiff, how far to the left of the fletched group are the bare shafts at 30 metres?
 

bolerus

Member
im left handed so it is to the right for me, and its about 6 inches at 20 yards. but I think I can handle a couple of extra pounds to bring them in a bit. when i first had them they were 29 inch and definalty whippy. had just over half an inch cut off and put pin nocks in, and that made them a bit stiff

- - - Updated - - -

im left handed so it is to the right for me, and its about 6 inches at 20 yards. but I think I can handle a couple of extra pounds to bring them in a bit. when i first had them they were 29 inch and definalty whippy. had just over half an inch cut off and put pin nocks in, and that made them a bit stiff
 

mbaker74

Supporter
Supporter
AIUK Saviour
If your 6" right at 20 yds I would say you should go to 620's. Get them half an inch longer than you currently have and fit 100 gr parabolic points. I would be looking to move out to 30metres for your bare shaft tuning, shows up the effect better.
 

bolerus

Member
I'm sorry. But that doesent make sense to me.

As I said originally the 570 arrows were half an inch longer but didn't have pin mocks and they were very noticbly weak. So I don't understand why you would suggest going to 620 and longer again. That sounds like a great way to throw away ?300. Perhaps you could elaborate. The only possible thing I can think there would be that you are suggesting removing the pin mocks. Just to get lighter arrows. Which will be even more effected by the wind than what I already have. Which is what I'm trying to improve
 

mbaker74

Supporter
Supporter
AIUK Saviour
I shoot recurve.

currently I am using a set of second hand ACE 570. at 28.5 with pin nocks and light points ( 86grains)

bareshaft tuning they are a little stiff ( since i put the pin nocks in) but only a little, and well its better to shoot too stiff than too whippy
If you are left handed, and your bare shafts are 6" to the right of the group at 20 yds it indicates the 570's are too stiff and you should drop a spine, which is what we suggested.
 

bolerus

Member
But. When I had them before cutting half an inch off and adding pin nocks they not only bateshafted too weak but you could see them going sideways in the wind. So I had them shortened and added pin nocks. Now they are stiff. But also the wind has a lot of effect on them at 80 yards. Going to lighter 620 is not going to help that. That does not make logical sense. If 570 at 29inch were too whippy how would buying 620 at 29 inch help in any way. That does not compute just because the chart says that I could use 620.. . Does not make it right yeah I could take the pin nocks out. But that would be silly... I already hit the back of one and destroyed the end of the pin nock (At 60 yards).

Does it make a difference that my points are inserts and screw in points.(currently have the lightest of the inserts along with the heaviest of the points) is this somehow giving a false reading?


I am very confused because what you are saying a d what I have seen with my own peepers do not correspond.

I am not trying to be argumentative or ungrateful but I need to have this right before I spend ?300 on a new set of arrows.
 

Rik

Supporter
Supporter
Do you know what your FOC is at present? A light point, plus nock pin may have made it a little on the low side. That wouldn't help in the wind.

Personally, I wouldn't touch screw-in points. Too variable in weight. If you're looking to get a new set of ACEs, buy a new set of points - 100gr probably - and try them on your current shafts. If they show up too stiff still (probably will) then you know that you need a size weaker. Points are relatively cheap to play with.
 

bolerus

Member
I have no idea on the foc. How would I go d that info? Good call on the points. A new set is a lot cheaper than new arrows. And I can I reuse them I guess )
 

Rik

Supporter
Supporter
I have no idea on the foc. How would I go d that info? Good call on the points. A new set is a lot cheaper than new arrows. And I can I reuse them I guess )
It's basically a not so straightforward measure of where the arrow centre of mass is. Kind of standardized to allow comparisons between different setups.

So balance the arrow on something (a pencil laid cross wise on a table will do). That's the centre of mass. But you want to express it as the distance in front of the centre of the shaft, as a percentage :).
so measure from the front of the shaft (not the point), to the balance point. Subtract that from half the length of the whole shaft. That's the actual distance in front of the centre.
Divide that result by the length of the shaft and multiply the resulting figure by 100, to get a percentage.
You should probably get 14 to 16% on an ACE.
 

bolerus

Member
Oh feck. I get 10.1%
Shaft length 71.5 cm. Balance point 27.5 from front. So ( 35.75 - 27.5 = 7.25 ) / 71.5 = 0 1013

So that means the points are too light, right?
 

Senlac

Supporter
Supporter
I've found 29.25" ACE 620s and 670s, both with 100grn and pin nocks, tune equally well at 37-38# OTF. So I went for 670s as they're slightly lighter than 620s - though the 670s do pass the riser very close (get the vanes a bit out and touching occurs). The same 670s are also good on my other bow at 40#.
I know this because I spashed out on a set of test arrows (4 each of ACE 520, 570, 620, 670, 720 - all rigged with screw-in points) and I methodically worked through the combinations at 13y (rough trial), 25y and 30y. Also tested various point weights (I think Easton reccomend max 100gr on 670/620?), button pressures, and strings.
If you're down my way (west London) do drop in and test vaious combinations one day.
I have also documented all my trials in a long (and large MB) paper. I'm LH so my notes/pics would apply to you too.
 

bolerus

Member
Thanks Rik, I will have a read of that. I did have a read of 6 pages of discusion on here about FOC as well last night. interesting read, with some differing of opinions as well :)

Sentac :- that would be great, unfortunatly I am in Stoke, dont get down to the big smoke very often, but if I find a reason to get down there.......

I am curious, on your finds. Another problem I have is that my sight pin so currently so far left that part of the casing is already lost behind my riser ( since one of the archery gb coaches came down - sorry I have very rudely forgotten his name - and got me to change my anchor point from the side of my chin to more at the middle, which is apparently the new way they coach the team)

How do the different spines and weights effect the left -right sight picture / aiming point.
 

Senlac

Supporter
Supporter
Hi bolerus.
Re your sight pin picture, it's not normal (so far as I know) for the sight pin to be far off the centre-line of the bow. I.e. if you string the bow and install rods, sight, and an arrow, then view the bow looking at the string... if you align your eye so that the string is exactly down the centre-line of the limbs and riser (may want to use Beiter alignment gauges to assist this): (a) the limbs and riser should be exactly in line (not even 1mm out at any point); (b) the long-rod should be pretty much in line (in line best, not 100% vital); (c) the arrow should be exactly in line (if it's an ACE, part-diameter out if not ACE); and the sight pin should be very close to the centre line too. If your sight pin is way off this, then something's significantly amiss. So the different spines and weights should not effect the left-right sight picture / aiming point. Rik will know more / correct me...
Re my tuning record, it's a bit big (38MB - lots of pics) but in case it's useful to you I've just uploaded it into a Dropbox here.
 

bolerus

Member
Yeah the pin is pretty much in line. I use a titon so the sight pin casing is bigger than say a beiter. I'll check it later... got to redo my string anyway. Will have a look at you paper work as Well. Thanks
 
Top