Clicker Commandments

Laurie

New member
Laurie, it's the arrow that goes backwards till the clicker sends it off in the other direction... scores, follow the arrows.
You see? This is what makes this forum so educative...now I know, thank you geoffretired, that the clicker should be on the BOWSTRING! Why has no one said this before???:duh::bang: :rotfl:
 


geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Why have I have found it so much LESS tense, outdoors at 60x...hmmmm
It might be that at short indoor range you expect such small groups that you shoot with more care. More care, usually means more slowly; there is more time to think and disturb the shot process.
 


Laurie

New member
It might be that at short indoor range you expect such small groups that you shoot with more care. More care, usually means more slowly; there is more time to think and disturb the shot process.
I don't want to turn this into a two person correspondence thread...... but today on short indoor range was a significant step forwards, it all became quite satisfying!! Now I have to get the next foot to go forwards, metaphorically!!! I think you ought to write tutorials and have them as fixed documents on this website!!
 


Laurie

New member
I don't want to turn this into a two person correspondence thread...... but today on short indoor range was a significant step forwards, it all became quite satisfying!! Now I have to get the next foot to go forwards, metaphorically!!! I think you ought to write tutorials and have them as fixed documents on this website!!
Yet again, GeoffRetired may well have hit the proverbial nail.......today I have committed a heinous crime, for after a year plus or fairly (well, very...) sporadic shooting with a clicker, I gave up on my clicker on a short 15x range: I was just hanging on soooo long to pull through....
The 30 odd arrows thereafter, went fairly well and tight without the clicker. We have our clubs signature event next w/e, and I'm due to do a WA 25 recurve in the morning (60 arrows) and again longbow in the afternoon. I haven't shot 60, never mind 120 arrows for I don't know how long, so I will do the recurve, clickerless........:scratchch

I still intend at longer distances, outdoors, to use the clicker...............
 


geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Hi Laurie,
Thanks for that post. I know of a few other archers who have done similar things.
It would be very interesting to find out what the differences were between the struggling shots with the clicker and the "easy through" ones without a clicker.
I wonder what a video would show?? The draw length would be worth examination; is the clickerless draw clearly shorter or very similar?
Does the draw with a clicker actually stall for a while, causing the struggle and delay?
 


Laurie

New member
Again yes, yes and yes !!
I know I don't have the opportunity to shoot anything like frequently enough at the moment, but it's been over a year now with the clicker. I understand very well the need to persist, indeed I've tried to encourage others to do so.
I really struggle through it, hanging around for inordinate lengths of time to loose, and with a 40lb bow, doing that every time is quickly tiring...and I'm, though old, a big fit chap!!! At longer distances outdoors, I don't find it such an issue....and I think the reasons are EXACTLY as your earlier post.

On Sunday, it will be imperative if shooting without the clicker to anchor consistently and accurately. Interestingly, the best? target archer in our club does not use a clicker. I'm not suggesting the two factors are absolute!! but hey ho.....

I've said it before, come and live in Suffolk so I can have some regular long term tutoring!!!
 


geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Hi Laurie,
I know a good few archers who have taken to the clicker like ducks to water. Out of those archers many of them learn to struggle as time passes!
Of the strugglers, a fair few remove the clicker and some even remove the sight and go barebow. They say they feel better about their shooting; and some get better scores ,too. I have have no quarrel with that; it is their archery and they take it up to enjoy it.
It is interesting to watch how their form changes, after removing the clicker and settling in for a year or so. A fair few struggle in new ways! The favourites being; to shoot as soon as the string touches their face; or to draw to a stop.... then wonder when to let go.
What saddens me a little is when I can see that the clicker has been ditched before it has been given a good chance;or in some cases before the archer has used it well for some time. That doesn't mean I will " keep on at them" to use a clicker. I let them give up with it before I give up with their clicker lessons. I will continue to help them shoot without the clicker, unless they just want to be left alone.
I am not going to try to persuade anyone to continue with a clicker when they have found their chosen form of shooting.
I will not try to persuade you to stick with a clicker either; although you are going to use it outdoors which is good thinking.
Let me finish this post with something to think about.
Imagine you catch the same train every working day. You have learnt over the months/years that it leaves on time very frequently.( rarely late)

You have worked out how long your walk to the station takes; and build that into your routine for leaving the house on time.
You may use two plans.
1 leave in time to arrive at the station a few seconds before departure time.
2 leave in time to arrive at the station 5 mins before departure time.
I feel that your walks to the station will be quite different depending on which plan you follow.
Plan 2 will allow you a relaxed walk; allow some flexibility to chat to a neighbour on your way, or collect a paper.
Plan 1 will be less relaxed I guess and no time for any delays. Any hold up at a crossing will require a speed up for the rest of the walk.
I would get stressed following plan 1
To my way of thinking a clicker can be used in a similar way.
You can set it so that as the string touches your face you have only 1mm left to draw.
Or you could set the clicker so that your string reaches the face and you still have 5mm left to draw.
With the 1mm setting you have no room for error. Pull a little too far and it's off before you are ready. Pull a little short and the extra couple of mm will take ages because your normal draw through is deliberately slow and short. The journey to and through the clicker should be relaxed, like plan 2 with room for variations that we will inevitably make.
 


Darth Tom

Member
I know a good few archers who have taken to the clicker like ducks to water. Out of those archers many of them learn to struggle as time passes!
This part makes perfect sense. Very few people are given good information about how a clicker works; more are confused by clueless coaches operating under some deeply flawed assumptions. Sadly "that's the way they were told to teach" so there's no use arguing with them. But it's upsetting watching archers give up or quit the sport when you can see it's because they're being taught rubbish.

You can set it so that as the string touches your face you have only 1mm left to draw.
Or you could set the clicker so that your string reaches the face and you still have 5mm left to draw.
With the 1mm setting you have no room for error. Pull a little too far and it's off before you are ready. Pull a little short and the extra couple of mm will take ages because your normal draw through is deliberately slow and short. The journey to and through the clicker should be relaxed, like plan 2 with room for variations that we will inevitably make.
This is a curious one: it's not that I think you're wrong (I completely agree that you need it to be relaxed, that's key!), but... the problem is that archers are lacking a consistent draw (and good release!) before putting a clicker on, then being given wrong information on how to use it. I like your approach but I think anything clicker-related will only work well if the archer has a really solid technique. If the draw length is inconsistent, it will never work (it's absolutely not a draw length check!). If the archer doesn't have a solid, strong, consistent release backward with a good follow through... they will struggle with a clicker. I've been having some thoughts about this recently but need to think about how to put it all together.
 


geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Hi DarthTom,
The clicker is a fascinating bit of kit, but as you say, it needs to be handled with understanding.
I nearly wrote that it needs to be handled " WITH CARE" but I refrained form saying that as it tends to get translated into; hesitantly, or too slowly.
I agree with you that the clicker isn't a draw length check; but must add that in its operation it does give an equal draw length to all shots, in a similar way, it is helpful at keeping arrows on the rest in a cross wind.
To my way of thinking, one of the great benefits of using a clicker is the way it encourages the user to continue the draw after the string reaches the face.So many newer archers draw to the face. STOP. aim and release. With a clicker fitted, the string reaches the face, but needs some more drawing before the click. An archer who is still drawing when they release, is far more likely to have a follow through that is a natural reaction to the sudden drop in holding weight.Those who draw to a stop, have to manufacture something that they have already lost.
When asked about fitting a clicker for the first time, one of the coaches from Lilleshall, said that one requirement is that the archer is able to draw the string to their face and still be able to draw some more before releasing. If they can't do that, there is no way a clicker can be used. I have kept that at the front of my mind ever since; it seems so clear and simple.
As to the ability to have a consistent draw; I would add that consistent in this case means that it happens in much the same way shot to shot.In the same way from start to finish. From raising the arms and getting the bow into position at arm's length. To drawing the string hand to a similar place below the jaw. The actual draw length may vary a bit (1cm) perhaps but the overall plan is repeating.
I can tie my shoelaces without looking, but the loops may not be the same size as each other nor the same size every time. I think I could be trained to make a better job of it. I am well on my way to warrant some training to get the loop sizes more consistent.
 


geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
When the first clicker was fitted and used, there must have been a reason. Likewise for the first pressure button/berger button.
However, the full potential of those devices was probably still in the future, waiting to be discovered. In the meantime I guess it is natural that some users had different opinions on what they were for and how they should be used. It is not surprising that there are many differing opinions in what is right.... or wrong.
How are we supposed to hold a smartphone when typing in a text message?
Who says it should be held so both the thumbs are free to do the typing?
 


Top