Hand twisting off string?

PeD

Member
Watching one of the recurve junior archers I’ve noticed that whilst the overall technique is good.
On his release his hand twists off the string. Using a slo mo you can see that the lowest finger is the first to start the twist.
Somehow he getting away with good shots in and around the 9’s but then you get the flier off into the 5’s etc. On the worst
of the releases his hand plucks off the string away from the jaw line.
The follow through rearward of the arm is good showing he’s using his back.

Anyone got an idea of curing this (apart from a piece of 2*4 which you’re not allowed to use any more) appreciated.
 

Timid Toad

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Staff member
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Ironman
Ok. He's doing what I do, it messes with tune, can make for a noisy bow, and it's a b*gger to fix.
First check he hasn't had a wrist or forearm injury - that's my problem - that might make it hard to get his hand vertical without stress trying to rotate the hand horizontal.
Then you have to look at making sure that ring finger does it's share of the work right through the shot - no cheating and coming off early. That might mean that his elbow needs to drop a little lower to get a better hook. Focussing the conscious on keeping the ring finger on the string helps me keep the back of my string hand vertical so I don't twist the string.
It's a common problem I see now I'm aware of it myself, especially in barebow shooters.
 

PeD

Member
Ok. He's doing what I do, it messes with tune, can make for a noisy bow, and it's a b*gger to fix.
First check he hasn't had a wrist or forearm injury - that's my problem - that might make it hard to get his hand vertical without stress trying to rotate the hand horizontal.
Then you have to look at making sure that ring finger does it's share of the work right through the shot - no cheating and coming off early. That might mean that his elbow needs to drop a little lower to get a better hook. Focussing the conscious on keeping the ring finger on the string helps me keep the back of my string hand vertical so I don't twist the string.
It's a common problem I see now I'm aware of it myself, especially in barebow shooters.
Funny you mention “noisy” bow. With his older limbs we could never get rid of a very sharp string slap noise. This has gone away with his new limbs. Will try the elbow and bigger hook. Thanks for the replies.
 

ThomVis

Active member
😂 just imagine they are ear-muffs.
It's a line to show a little head tilt. Before you start the draw you tilt your head forward to the final position which can help with getting your shoulders down.
 

tisbatman^^

New member
Actually I have been doing something quite similar and I´m working on it right now with a coach. A very good tip is to maintain a curl in the little finger during the shot, as ring and little finger are connected. Pay attention not to let the little finger uncurl during expansion. Also you can try to slightly touch the neck with the little finger. There´s some experimentation to be done to find the right amount of curl. Maintain this feeling during the release.
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
the releases his hand plucks off the string away from the jaw line.
The follow through rearward of the arm is good showing he’s using his back
Quite often, newer archers end up with the draw hand pulled away from the jaw line.
If you mime that action for yourself, you will fine the elbow joint is being opened.
If you watch the elbow throughout the draw, the joint is closing.( forearm getting closer to the upper arm)
Why should the elbow suddenly start to work in the opposite direction, just at the point of release?
I think it is probably an accidental action that the archer is making while being unaware of it.
If the archer thinks about the elbow joint closing all through the draw, and beyond the time of the release, that can take the mind off releasing the string. Thinking about releasing the string quite often leads to deliberate releases that cause problems.
 
I've been guilty of this. Lately, I've found that it's been helpful to use the little hook-y thing at the bottom of my tab to hold my little finger in place.
 

FernbankArcher

New member
AIUK Saviour
There's a general anatomical issue.
If the elbow (draw side) is somewhere behind the archers head: String hand palm vertical and thumb up is near the limit that the twisting radius and ulna (forearm bones) will allow. Beyond the limit for some I've known, making it difficult to keep the third finger "properly" on the string and giving the twisting release. Your guy might be one of these.

(Compare with the hand orientation adopted by release shooters. Usually palm down, even approaching thumb down.)
Thumb lock is similar. The hand is palm down.

I spent several hours watching 2012 Olympic coverage, watching drawing hand specifically. I realised that several of the top-flight shooters had fingertips lower than the knuckle they were attached to i.e. palm not vertical. All sorts of hand angle variations generally. Didn't seem to cause them too much of a problem ...
You can't do anything to change the bone structure: Work with what you have. Third finger is short for most folk, and the weakest.
Important (my view) is to keep the string in the first joint (of however many finger you use). This minimises the muscle tension required to hold.
Relax the hand and forearm during the hold and, ultimately, loose by allowing the string to open the fingers. Look to the arm alignment during the hold: Is this following the draw force line?

Muscle can't relax instantly. Residual muscle tension, once the string has gone, will cause the fingers to close again. Fly-away fingers (hand forced wide open) indicates tension in the muscles that straighten the fingers. That tension shouldn't be there. Is this what's happening?
Hand flying away from the face seems to indicate tricep tension (elbow extension). Not a muscle I would expect to be active.

Fly-away-Loose... I do that occasionally too. In my case, I reckon it's a psychological issue. "Something" not quite right, the shot sequence falters and there's no confidence in the loose.
Have you tried "blank butt"? This allows total focus on shot technique, removing the "aim" element. If the flyaway stops this may indicate a possible cause of the problem.
 

A16KSB

Member
Watching one of the recurve junior archers I’ve noticed that whilst the overall technique is good.
On his release his hand twists off the string. Using a slo mo you can see that the lowest finger is the first to start the twist.
Somehow he getting away with good shots in and around the 9’s but then you get the flier off into the 5’s etc. On the worst
of the releases his hand plucks off the string away from the jaw line.
The follow through rearward of the arm is good showing he’s using his back.

Anyone got an idea of curing this (apart from a piece of 2*4 which you’re not allowed to use any more) appreciated.
Sometimes asking the archer to use their pinky finger to touch their neck actually solves this. When the pinky is pointed towards or slightly touching the neck it rotates the draw hand and sets it in a vertical position.
 

FernbankArcher

New member
AIUK Saviour
Sometimes asking the archer to use their pinky finger to touch their neck actually solves this. When the pinky is pointed towards or slightly touching the neck it rotates the draw hand and sets it in a vertical position.


I agree. This should work provided the wrist isn't already at the limit of rotation, which is the point I was making.
On a slight thought tangent: If you tense either/both thumb and little finger, the working tendons (going through the wrist) that control these digits may introduce a stress through the wrist. I've always taken the line " If you don't need to work a muscle, then don't. " i.e. keep everything as relaxed as possible, especially around the string hand. Same line as "flyaway" fingers (almost) arching back after the loose; tension where none is needed in that case.

At full draw, the orientation of the string hand palm is dependant on the position of its connected elbow relative to the shoulder.
With the elbow in the bow plane (defined by the bow and the string) and the forearm following the DFL (draw force line, also in the bow plane), the elbow will (typically) sit above, and forward of, the shoulder joint: The shoulder isn't in the bow plane therefore the upper arm isn't in the bow plane.
The upper arm and the forearm define a plane and the elbow "hinge pin" is normal (mathematically) to it. Since this plane isn't usually horizontal (unless you draw straight across the shoulders, Henry VIII medieval style), the elbow hinge is unlikely to be vertical.
The string hand palm, near the limit of its rotation, is typically about parallel to the elbow hinge (pin). e.g. Try this on yourself. Bend your elbow, with forearm across at waist height, and set your hand /palm parallel to your upper arm (flat on your belt). Rotate your palm /forearm both ways and check the limits you can achieve without external aid. My limit, palm up and palm down: The flat hand lies parallel to the elbow hinge. Does that make sense? I'd be interested to know if my limit is typical (or if I'm odd , physically. Leave mental out of it?).
For the palm to be truly vertical at full draw, the elbow hinge needs to be near vertical. The plane defined by upper arm isn't horizontal so there's a conflict.

Most folk I see don't have the string hand truly vertical but slightly rotated "palm down".
Thoughts, please, if you have managed to follow that convoluted thought train.
 
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