Resistance Release Newbie - Shot Consistency

BaconVII

New member
Hi all. I'm hoping that some of you may be able to offer some advice or an opinion here.

I have been shooting compound now for about 4 years and during this time I have been using a thumb trigger release, more recent tool of choice being a Stan Perfex.

I know that sometimes when shooting thumb trigger that I can fall back in to bad habits and start to shoot lazily, i.e. not really pulling through the shot and just sitting on the back wall and then triggering the shot. I'm working on this and its much better now.

To try and help, I have now also got a Stan Perfex resistance release (as I like the fit/feel of the thumb version) and have been working with it for about 3 weeks (so still early days). I have passed my initiation with just the one episode of punching-yourself-in-the-face. Thou must keep thy thumb on the safety lock when drawing thy bow.

The problem I am having is consistency. I know that this is most likely me, but I find that despite multiple attempts to set the release, I just cannot get it to fire consistently. At the moment I can get 3 or 4 out of 6 shots to execute well, but the other 2-3 just won't go. It feels like I'm having to pull so hard that I'm about to pull the D-loop off. obviously when this happens form breaks down and when the shot does fire its just all over the place. Even if I do come down to reset myself and the release and go again, it still feels like I'm having to pull much much harder than the other shots to get the release to fire. Sometimes to the point that I'm cranking my wrist and snatching at the release to get it to go off.

Does anyone have much experience with these releases ? Do they need 'shooting in' ?

I plan on doing a more thorough measurement of this by drawing against a peak-hold bow scale with the release and measuring the consistency of the pull force needed to fire the release to try an confirm its not a mechanical issue, and the issue is me not the release, but I thought I'd reach out to the collective and see if anyone can proffer some advice.

I know my form isn't brilliant, but I don't think its bad enough to cause the issue I'm having.

Anyway, and advice/opinions welcomed.

Thanks in advance.
 

Kernowlad

Supporter
Supporter
I had a total nightmare when I went to a Thumb release and hastily returned to a decent wrist one! The worst TP I've ever had (I'd never had it before) and several lost ACG arrows!
 

BaconVII

New member
Luckily I've been OK with TP, though I have had my moments with it. I'm just really struggling with this resistance release.
I was hoping it might help me tighten up my form and shot routine, but at the moment its doing the opposite.
 

ArcheryFox

Active member
I use a resistance release aid as a training tool.
They do not need 'shooting in' as they are a metal mechanism. However, it can take a while to get used to them executing predictably (for sake of a better word... - it is still a surprise release, but I mean not too going off too soon or not at all).

My advice would be to make sure you are both pushing and pulling. I found that if you are just mostly pulling you can end up distorting yourself out of alignment and the release will never go, no matter how hard you feel you are trying - just as you describe with form breaking down. Make sure you are stood up straight and stay so throughout the shot, and then increase pressure front and back. Once I figured out I how to properly push/support on the front end I actually had to increase the tension of the release!
I also found it helps to have good front hand positioning (thumb to target) and to maintain good alignment (get that rear shoulder round and in line!) which many compound archers struggle with.

Even after using for a while I still find that it can be a little temperamental. I'll have a shot that goes off a littlwe too quickly and so I instinctively pull a little less on the next one and it doesn't go. I also find it getting harder to execute towards the end of a session as I get tired. As such I'd never choose to use a resistance release aid in competition.
My favourite way to use it is alternating ends/dozens with my preferred (thumb trigger) release to make sure that I know the feeling of keeping a balanced shot, pushing and pulling through to the end, and then transfer this feeling over to the trigger.
That, and as an emergency plaster if I start to panic in competition...
 

BaconVII

New member
I think you may have highlighted on of my failings. I can relate to the push/pull description, and I fear I am guilty of pulling rather than pushing and pulling.

I'll have another go over the weekend and see how I get on. Thanks for the hint on grip/thumb position too.
 

KidCurry

Well-known member
AIUK Saviour
I tried one years ago and binned it immediately due to lack of consistent force needed to get it to release. I thought they had improved but I still hear these issues from time to time.
 

yavinmaster

New member
I shoot a Carter Evo+ resistance release aid. Some days it seems to go off too quickly or slowly but a minor tweak of the setting fixes this. To give you an idea of the issue, I've shot most days this summer and had to do this tweak about five times.
I tried a Stan perfex about a year ago and found I had to constantly tweak it. After nearly 2 weeks of trying I sent it back. I also tried a Carter 'Evo too' but that just didn't work well at all. I know there are people out there who have no issues with the Perfex and possibly some who have issues with the Evo, my point is that there appears to be good and bad releases.

The other comments are however correct. Your push pull needs to be reasonably consistent to get a resistance release to work. You also need to make sure your draw hand is relaxed enough to let the release do its thing. I personally have the release quite heavy and find this far better than trying to set it on a hair.

As an aside, Lancaster archery appear to have jumped the gun in advertising a new Carter Evo release that isn't mentioned on the Carter website yet. I'd love to get my hands on one of those to try.
 

garethochse

New member
I also shoot a Stan Perfex. They're invaluable as a training aid because you cannot shoot it if your shot collapses in any way, also because they teach how hard it is to be consistent in your expansion. They are consistent. You are not. Try experiment with how much force above holding weight you need - I was light to start but as I got better with back tension I had to increase it. The angle of the forces makes a huge difference - e.g string elbow back way more than I expected got my shots far more consistent. Try that? One of my favourite releases...
 

BaconVII

New member
I also shoot a Stan Perfex. They're invaluable as a training aid because you cannot shoot it if your shot collapses in any way, also because they teach how hard it is to be consistent in your expansion. They are consistent. You are not. Try experiment with how much force above holding weight you need - I was light to start but as I got better with back tension I had to increase it. The angle of the forces makes a huge difference - e.g string elbow back way more than I expected got my shots far more consistent. Try that? One of my favourite releases...
Thanks for the advice - I'll certainly give it a try.

I did take a closer loot at the release over the weekend and I'm wondering if the set screw (which is hollow to allow the spring to recess inside it) was fouling the spring and causing it to become unnecessarily compressed, making the release very very cold. I have reset it now, and whilst I haven't been able to shoot the bow yet, using a spare piece of chord and doing some practice releases it seems way more consistent now.
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
One problem with any release aid is thinking you are doing the same thing in the same way or to the same degree, when the truth is there are variations in what we are actually doing. Clicker users get the same issue with the clicker that goes off early; or late. or not at all.
I have a Stan Perfex thumb. It is a wonderfully smooth piece of kit. If I am not wonderfully consistent with it, it says, " You are not being consistent... not matter what YOU think.
 

Kernowlad

Supporter
Supporter
My issue was using two forms of tension; to grip the release as well as draw the bow.
With a wrist release there is no tension in your hand.
And when I realease, my brain likes to know exactly when to tell my finger to shoot, not a vague guess.

But clearly it’s different for many.
 
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BaconVII

New member
I totally agree, lack of consistency and overthinking the shot has (and most likely always will) cause me problems. I'm getting better, but this resistance release really highlights it.

I'll stick with it (even if its a just a training aid).
 

geoffretired

Supporter
Supporter
Learning the way to trigger a thumb is not always as straightforward as we expect. Same with resistance ones. We only need to move our focus from drawing in order aim or to trigger and we end up in a situation that we are not in control of.
I find the drawing has to include the triggering mechanism on a trigger release. The resistance types need a draw that we are certain about, and confident enough to know it will go.
 

williamsga

New member
It's not uncommon to hear folks claim that Resistance Releases are unreliable. Whilst there are undoubtedly some mechanical failures I feel that, in the main, it's likely to be down to operator error'. The Resistance Release is a mechanical device which is activated by pressure. How consistently that pressure is applied and to which area of the hook is going to determine when it breaks. I thought this was a very interesting post by 'Nuts and Bolts' from Archery Talk.
The resistance release is a very picky training tool. Release elbow higher or lower than normal, the resistance release will let you know. So, you THINK you are pulling through the shot, and it seems like the "release" is taking longer (more time) to fire, and you have to seemingly PULL harder? Could be your fingers are stretching, and you are growing the shape of the curl of your fingers, so the release does not move away from the riser, but you FEEL like you are pulling. So, focus on a consistent curl shape of the fingers around the release (hook shape for fingers).

I went through all the things you describe, wonder WHY the release seems sometimes hot and sometimes cold. Took me a while to figure out it was the angle of the handle. INSIDE is a see-saw mechanism. Yes, the see saw mechanism is sensitive to gravity, so the angle of the handle mattters. Learn how to get a consistent angle of the handle, on your resistance release, and then ALL the other releases will fire tighter groups as well.

Keep the bones in the back of your hand in line with the forearm...meaning, don't cock your wrist (bend it sideways). Keep forearm relaxed, and everything from release elbow to wrist to back of hand, will all be inline, and the Evo will suddenly become more and more consistent for you.

Like Kelly says (BlindArcher), keep the bow side shoulder down, keep both collar bones level, and more of your pulling force transfers into the release and the bowstring (pull through the shot). If you lean backwards, and you allow the bow shoulder to pop up more and more, you THINK you are pulling the release, and all you are really doing is leaning backwards more and popping up the bow shoulder more. Door mirror on the wall opposite you on the firing line in the garage, will help SIGHTED shooters learn a whole bunch about their form, and why the Evo release is taking longer than normal to fire.


Nuts and Bolts was referring to the Carter Evolution but I guess his remarks will extend to other makes of resistance releases. I had a Stan Element and couldn't get on with it - I think I now know the reason why!!!!
 

jerryRTD

Well-known member
I have tried a Break Through by Hamskea and I have problems with 'not going off'. I go back to my Carter Quicky or Carter Two shot wrist releases you get alignment without having to think about it too much.
There is a tendancy to look at a problem from the assumption that if a release does not go off the the problem is with the release aid. As has been pointed out already the archer plays a significant part. Without consistant form you will not get a consistant release . That leaves the bow What effect does a soggy back wall have???
 
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Howi

Member
One problem with any release aid is thinking you are doing the same thing in the same way or to the same degree, when the truth is there are variations in what we are actually doing. Clicker users get the same issue with the clicker that goes off early; or late. or not at all.
I have a Stan Perfex thumb. It is a wonderfully smooth piece of kit. If I am not wonderfully consistent with it, it says, " You are not being consistent... not matter what YOU think.
well said geoffretired, resistance releases need to be treeted like clicker shooting on recurve, you must pull as you would to get through a clicker, twisting the release hand will do nothing. if you really want to know how to shoot resistance release John Dudley has some good videos.
they also need carefull setup, i went for 2lb above holding weight, anything heavier and i would struggle when i got tired.
 

BaconVII

New member
Hi All,

Thanks for the feedback. Having re-seated the spring behind the set screw on the release I have now managed to shoot 7-8 dozen arrows with the release without it locking up. Previously it was 4-6 shots at best.

That's not to say it was smooth sailing, as pointed out be others above, these releases do punish you when your are not consistent. Some shots seem effortless, others put up a bit of a fight - I know that its me and something that I need to work on, but at least now I have more confidence in that the release will fire if I use it correctly.

Thanks for all the comments/advice. I just need to get on with more practice with it.


Cheers.
 
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