wooden arrows points problem

PLEASE HELP TO FUND ARCHERY INTERCHANGE

bolerus

Member
ok. I made my first set of wooden arrows ( to go with a pvc bow i made)

i used super glue ( probably the mistake) on the points. shot them into my layered foam target, and the tips started to come off.

Took them off, re- glued and heated the tips.

gave them a while to harden / dry, and gave a couple a tug with pliars to check they were on well.

fired them into target, and they came off

( I now have 4 arrow points inside my layered foam, that i can get out)

so.. any body got any helping advice, I just ordered some insert iron from merlin...

and what woudl you suggest about the tips in the foam layers, is it ok to leave them or do i really have to take the whole thing apart to get them out ( its only a month or so old, so not even slightly shot out yet)
 

Riceburner

Active member
Try TopHats - I've heard that some of the newer glues just aren't strong enough.

Sent from my ASUS Transformer Pad TF300T using Tapatalk 4
 

Hudzi93

New member
If you want your points to be stuck on permanently, use something like araldite 2 part epoxy glue. I used araldite precision on my arrows and I couldn't get them off even when I wanted too.
 

Del the Cat

Well-known member
I use taper fit rather than parallel. I use a good quality 10 minute epoxy and make sure I clean the inside of the point with a quick swirl around with a needle file and then a bit of methylated spirit as it can have cutting oil, rust etc in there which stops the glue sticking.
Del
 

woodsplitter

Member
Ironman
American Shoot
On the first woodies I made I used screw-on tapered brass points with no adhesive of any kind. They stayed on in foam bosses, but some came off in straw. I tried again using hot-melt with the brass points and with steel points (also tapered screws) and have not had one come off in a boss since.
I clean the inside of the point with methylated spirit to remove any residual cutting oil, apply the glue to the shaft and immediately screw the point on lightly, mainly just to spread the glue. Once they are all on, I heat each point and screw it on properly using pliers with a couple of leather strips stuck to the jaws to protect the metal.
 

bolerus

Member
the ones i bought were tapered, but not screw on.

lots of things to learn at the beginning, isnt there.

Thanks for the advice.

When you heat the tips, how long do you heat them for

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the ones i bought were tapered, but not screw on.

lots of things to learn at the beginning, isnt there.

Thanks for the advice.

When you heat the tips, how long do you heat them for
 

woodsplitter

Member
Ironman
American Shoot
When you heat the tips, how long do you heat them for
When I first put them on, they're not necessarily straight, nor are they screwed all the way down but the glue has had more or less enough time to harden. When I heat them the glue softens and turning the shaft allows the point to move around, or rather the shaft moves and the point doesn't. You'll see what I mean if you try it. At that stage screw the point down tight, make sure it's straight and hold for half-a-minute or so (I think, I've never actually timed it) until the glue starts to cool. Job done.

Happy shooting!
 

bolerus

Member
del, I have a taper tool ( luckily somebody i know has moved to thicker shafts and gave me his old one, after the first one i 'tapered' with a pencil sharpener )

looking on merlin, i cant see screw taper points

these are the ones i have gotten

Traditional 'Taper Fit' Steel Point - from Merlin Archery Ltd

are they the wrong ones? although i just spotted
3D ALUMINIUM Screw-On Point - 5/16 - 40g" - from Merlin Archery Ltd

are they tapered as well ?


i think the main place i went wrong is that i didnt clean the inside of the points out, before putting them on, so maybe the residual oil stopped the glue being so effective.....

great thing about this site, is there is always somebody who has made the same or similiar mistake, and can correct you :) and people who just know more than me.

thanks again guys.
 

WillS

New member
I use Superglue (the Loctite stuff) all the time for arrow points. I've yet to lose one. Superglue bonds exceptionally well to wood and metal, so provided the fit is good and you use enough then they definitely shouldn't come off just from pulling out of a target.

One thing you might want to consider is that if the point doesn't fit flush with the shaft, you end up with a little lip. As you pull the arrow out, that lip can catch on certain target materials and you just end up yanking the arrow shaft out, leaving the point in.


Make sure the point sits flush with the shoulder of the shaft and you'll avoid that particular issue.


On my "nice" arrows (either my expensive hand-forged war heads or my good set of target/field arrows, I also rivet the head on, simply by drilling a small hole all the way through the head and wooden taper inside, then pushing thick steel wire through and peening the ends with a hammer. Keeps the heads on just that little bit stronger!
 
All good advise. Superglue (the runny type) tends to shatter on impact so not suitable for attaching piles. Superglue gel stays slightly rubbery when set as I understand so might be OK as in the last post. I use Araldite slow set (in a blue tube) in preference.
To get your piles out of your boss you need a pile pusher. This is a length of metal slightly longer than the boss is thick and slightly narrower than the internal diameter of the pile. Some long, narrow screwdrivers might be suitable but you may have to file the blade to fit. Push in to the boss where the pile is. If you have not marked the entry point you may have to use a metal detector to find them and even then be prepared to take a couple of attempts to find the lost pile. Push through & the pile should drop out the back while the pusher is pulled back out the way it went in. There ought to be no need to take the boss to bits (can we assume this is a layered foam - Mundon - boss? If so it is difficult to see how the impact was sufficient to crack the bond even with Superglue)
Try not to leave the piles in. If an arrow is shot on top of a lost pile you may get away with it or you may damage the shot arrow, especially with brass piles. If the shot arrow has a narrower diameter you might even manage to end up loosing two piles, the second embedded in the first!
 

WillS

New member
I use the runny superglue for all sorts of things, from fitting horn nocks to bows (it penetrates the fibres of the horn and wood nicely!) to repairing cracks and shakes in bow limbs, fitting horn inserts into arrow nocks, attaching points, securing silk nocking points to serving, gluing serving to bowstring...

Every time I walk past a shop doing a deal on any type of superglue I buy loads of it! It's one of the few things I have on me at any shoot. As I said above, I've yet to have a point come off (or indeed the glue to fail on impact) so I think it's down to how the job is done, rather than what with.
 

bobnewboy

Member
I always use Araldite, either the Precision or Rapid types and dont have piles come off. I agree with what has been written here re: good straight tapers and cleaning out piles, but there is one other secret to fixing a pile on so that it doesnt come off. It is to cut or impress a slight channel along the wooden taper of the shaft. This allows excess glue, and more importantly, trapped air to escape from between the pile socket and the wooden taper.

When the shaft is rammed home into the pile socket and checked for alignment, air bubbles and excess glue are expelled and the fit is as good as it can be. I cannot claim this to be my original thought however, as it was taught to me by Carol many years back, and has served me well ever since.
 

Anglian Archer

New member
I use taper fit rather than parallel. I use a good quality 10 minute epoxy and make sure I clean the inside of the point with a quick swirl around with a needle file and then a bit of methylated spirit as it can have cutting oil, rust etc in there which stops the glue sticking.
Del
Cleaning is the most important part of the process IMO. I know a few DIYers who have nothing but trouble with their points, the reason seeming to be that they never clean them. What I do is pour half and inch of meths into a jam jar, pour in my points (top up to cover them if necessary) then scour out the insides using wire wool wrapped round a satay skewer (like a meta cotton bud). Then I rinse them again in fresh meths and let them dry off. I glue with slow setting Araldite. I've never had an issue with lost points.
 

Raven's_Eye

Active member
Ironman
I've personally never cleaned the inside of my arrow points, and since I started using slow drying Resin, I've never had a point fall off.
 

Simon Banks

New member
I do heat them up to burn off any oil or wax that they have been coated with.. It also gives them a tighter fit if you press the shafts hard into the piles whilst hot... I never have problems with piles coming off. Piles snapped of yes but that's another story...
 

bolerus

Member
just an update....

After first posting this thread, I moved off 'super' glue. and bought some epoxy glue.

at the same time, i cleaned all the piles i had with white spirits.

I have made about 18 arrows since ( not a lot i know but im a newbie) and not one pile has come off since.

to clean them, im probably being lazy. i dribble a little white spirits into a the cap. dip some twisted kitchen towel in it. rub that inside the pile.

then rub a little bit of sandpaper inside. and then dry towell, then finally a bit of dowell, that is a bit too thin for the pile, and give that a rub around.
whole process takes about 30 seconds to 1 minute per pile.

May not be the correct way to do it, but it works ( so far)

I hate the smell of epoxy, so i have used some iron insert on a few to see ( bought it from merlin amongst a load of other stuff) and the few I have use3d that on have stayed on as well. the epoxy was a lot cheaper though, so i may just put up with the smell when i run out

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I keep seeing the funny side of the title and think that the problem is with the wooden points.
arguably you could say that it was, the points ( or tapers) weren't sticking to the piles :p
 
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